“The Role of Discipline in the ‘Most Perfect School of Christ on Earth’”: Based on the examples given here, what kinds of activities did the Calvinist Consistory of Geneva seek to root out and prevent? Why was Calvinism so determined to survey and control the personal lives of citizens? How do you think the development of such Protestant agencies of social discipline and social control made way for the development of modern institutions of order such as the police? (p.363)
8 comments:
Calvinism was concerned to survey and control the lives of citizens to enforce one of John Calvin's greatest emphasis's, which was the enforcement of "proper behavior."
One of the activities they wished to root out and prevent was the worshiping of other idols besides God. The Genevan Consistory report gave an example of such action. Donna Jane Peterman arose suspicion when she skipped a day of worship and communion. She does not deny God, and is able to recite the Lords Prayer , but she says she is simply not use to the change from the old religion her parents raised her with, to Calvinism. Now im sure this wasn't the first time someone was questioned about their faith.
"The enforcement of the church in Geneva, provided for an order of elders whose function was to cooperate with the pastors in maintaining discipline." Perhaps this was beginning of having people enforce a law for the good of social stability. Today we have our modern police officers, but they do not enforce God's laws but more along the lines of moral issues.
Danny's last point is interesting, because it points to the fact that the Geneva of Calvin and the Consistory was a theocracy -- that is, it was rule by the church. Therefore, unlike our 21st C secular government, the state (and police) were enforcing moral and religious norms as well as secular law.
Danny's points regarding the question i agree with his response. The only thing i would like to add is that i think that the reason Calvinism was concerned to survey and control the lives of citizens was not only to enforce Calvin's greatest emphasis of proper behavior, but to make sure that the citizens were predestined. Predestined meant that God decided on some people to be saved and others to be damned. I believe that they wanted their citizens to be saved and not damned, so thats why they wanted to control their citizens lives.
if people were blasphemis they would be greater punishments then excommumication..stricter laws were public whippings and banishment. Believed the sacraments where jesus is presnet spiritually not really there considering jesus is seated at the right hand of god.If he controled the people then there would be no problems people wouild believe they could get into heaven if they were good or wealthy , the police now a days can't do anything based on religion because we believe they shoild be seperate.now we just enforec moral laws
Let's be careful how we treat predestination. Calvin's Consistory, as Regina stated, was very much concerned with controlling the lives of its citizens. However, if anyone in Geneva at the time had said that any human being or organization could somehow act to make sure someone was predestined, they would have been accused of heresy (and we know what happens then!). Only God can determine whether anyone is predestined or not.
Still, I think Regina is onto a good point -- moral and spiritual conformaty in Geneva was considered a sign that one was potentially one of the elect.
conformity*
I absolutely agree with Danny...except for the bit at the end about not enforcing God's laws but along the lines of morality.
There lots of instances, I believe, where Calvinism still resides. The army is run with its generals and ranking like Calvinism. So its sort of like modern Calvinism, they are preaching their own type of religion, democracy.
On another note, Calvin's predestination is rather hard to understand. What would he do to the converts into his religion in order to revert them back to being "saved"? His whole argument is arbitrary, you could never really know if what you did would save you. And In my (probably most controversial) opinion, Calvin was only using the Consistory to further his own political aims to maintain his power , and any challenges (could have paralleled him with the papacy) would be considered heresy.
We already can see that they sought out others that remained individuals and refused to conform to Calvinist ways, and as Lisec said, they would be considered heretics. Those that they did control, were only controlled so that they could morph them into their little pawns. I think that the whole Calvinist movement, was a power shock, and it was all that he really wanted. Power.
As for society today, with its government rankings and police, I still think its just a way for them to control us without getting into the whole "God is going to send you to Hell" bit.
I agree with Sandy that the whole Predestination thing is pretty out there -- really hard to grasp from our modern point of view. When she says that "you could never really know if what you did would save you," she is spot on, perhaps without intending to be. That is, in fact, the whole point. There was NOTHING you could DO to be saved. This was not a religion of good works (charity, atonement, saying Hail Marys) leading to salvation. The only thing that could save you was Faith, and even then, if you had not been Predestined by God to be one of the ELECT, even Faith wouldn't save you.
Calvinism was, in some ways, a very harsh, bleak form of Christianity.
On another note, I am not sure I agree with her view of Calvin's cynical grasp of power for power's sake. I think that, yes he did crave power, but he wanted that power so that he could use it to ensure that the Faithful remained true. He was, like all fanatics, convinced that he was right and that only he could ensure that others walked the path of righteousness
Calvin wanted to eliminate the worship of idols. He wanted all to worship God and only God. Calvinism was so determined to control citizens lives to keep them on the right track and prevent citizens from practicing anything other than Calvinism. Moral Laws is the key word the modern police cant follow religious laws because it is morally wrong.
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